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  1. #11
    singersp's Avatar
    singersp is offline PPO Newshound
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    Re: Ditka's calls Upshaw a fraud

    "PurpleGator" wrote:

    A lot of people don't like Upshaw.
    There have been so many people talking about how he handles things.
    He is a little cocky and thinks he is a god.
    I think a lot of the current players don't like him.
    Who was the person that blasted him last year?
    I forgot who it was but I remember last year he got into it with somebody.
    That would be our very own Matt Birk. How soon you forgot.........

    [size=13pt]Vikings Birk Rips NFL Union Boss Upshaw[/size]


    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  2. #12
    Billy Boy is offline Hall of Famer
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    Re: Ditka's calls Upshaw a fraud

    "Overlord" wrote:
    "cajunvike" wrote:
    But it's the American way!
    It is no less an affront to these old veterans as it is the way that our returning soldiers from Iraq (and those who returned from Vietnam years ago) are being treated.

    Gene Upshaw and the rest of the NFLPA should be ashamed of themselves...as should the rest of the country as regards our soldiers!
    We're all responsible for how our soldiers are treated, and we should do what we can to make sure they're treated right.

    But as to retired NFL players, I don't think you can call out Upshaw on that.
    Simply put, it's not his responsibility.
    His job is to look after the guys in the players association.
    The retired guys aren't in it.

    It's the NFL or the retired players themselves that should find someone else to represent their interests, and it's really the NFL owners that should take any heat on this.
    How is Upshaw not responsible for alumni related issues.
    NFLPA is repsonsible for the pension of NFL players.
    Upshaw is its President.


    All the kids my age pee their pants, it's the coolest.

  3. #13
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    Re: Ditka's calls Upshaw a fraud

    "Billy" wrote:
    How is Upshaw not responsible for alumni related issues.
    NFLPA is repsonsible for the pension of NFL players.
    Upshaw is its President.
    I think the NFLPA (as opposed to the NFL or teams) distributes pensions that have been voted on and approved by current players.
    These protect the current players after they have retired and left the union, which is why they support them when they come up for a vote.

    I think the example I can give is from 1993-94, when the labor agreement was put into place, there was a pension set up for the players of the time.
    The amount of money they got was based on the amount of time they played in the league.
    Years played before 1993 counted, but only for players that were playing in 1993-94 (I'm sorry, but I forgot the link for this, and don't really have time to find it right now).
    So if you retired the year before and were out of the union when they made the deal, you got nothing.
    The current pensions are for the most part the same: those that are being distributed were voted for when those players were playing.

    The exception to this is cases where they voted for pensions because the players felt bad about the poor pension plan.
    These do exist, but they're very minimal.
    If those guys could vote, they'd be much bigger.

    In the end, the the job of the executives of the NFLPA is to be responsible to and look after the interests of the voting members - current players.
    When the age of the Vikings came to a close, they must have sensed it. Probably, they gathered together one evening, slapped each other on the back and said, "Hey, good job." - Jack Handey [Deep Thoughts]

  4. #14
    Billy Boy is offline Hall of Famer
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    Re: Ditka's calls Upshaw a fraud

    "Overlord" wrote:
    "Billy" wrote:
    How is Upshaw not responsible for alumni related issues.
    NFLPA is repsonsible for the pension of NFL players.
    Upshaw is its President.
    I think the NFLPA (as opposed to the NFL or teams) distributes pensions that have been voted on and approved by current players.
    These protect the current players after they have retired and left the union, which is why they support them when they come up for a vote.

    I think the example I can give is from 1993-94, when the labor agreement was put into place, there was a pension set up for the players of the time.
    The amount of money they got was based on the amount of time they played in the league.
    Years played before 1993 counted, but only for players that were playing in 1993-94 (I'm sorry, but I forgot the link for this, and don't really have time to find it right now).
    So if you retired the year before and were out of the union when they made the deal, you got nothing.
    The current pensions are for the most part the same: those that are being distributed were voted for when those players were playing.

    The exception to this is cases where they voted for pensions because the players felt bad about the poor pension plan.
    These do exist, but they're very minimal.
    If those guys could vote, they'd be much bigger.

    In the end, the the job of the executives of the NFLPA is to be responsible to and look after the interests of the voting members - current players.
    Good info, I am learning as I go.
    So as I have understood it before and still do players vote to put a certain percentage away in what is essentially an IRA for themselves.

    It seems to me the players that are having problems with this system are the players that played before they were being payed the exorbitant salary they are today
    (The Edgerrin James of 20 years ago?
    Poor guy.) and also before this system was in effect.


    It must be a serious issue for some retirees for them to speak up to the point where Upshaw makes such threats as eliminating alumni chapters, and also for such credible players such as Birk (and Ditka) to support them.

    I understand that you think teams should supply necessary pension (makes sense to me)
    but as the system is right now it is a NFLPA matter and in Upshaw's hands but according to the retirees he isn't doing enough.

    I think the likely possibility is that it is the retired players problem, and like you said they are not the ones that elect Upshaw, so he will ignore it until the exceptional salaries catch up with the retirees and make sure nobody has to worry about pensions.

    No matter how I look at it this guy seems like a prick worried about his incumbency.


    All the kids my age pee their pants, it's the coolest.

  5. #15
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    Re: Ditka's calls Upshaw a fraud

    "Billy" wrote:
    It seems to me the players that are having problems with this system are the players that played before they were being payed the exorbitant salary they are today
    (The Edgerrin James of 20 years ago?
    Poor guy.) and also before this system was in effect.

    I think that it is especially the pre-1977 players that are really getting the short end of the stick.
    They get something like $250/year for each year they were in the league (guess where I pulled that number out of...).
    Ten year veteran and hall of fame player from 1965-1975?
    Thanks, here's your $2,500 pension.
    How far does that go with medical bills for 60 year old guys that played football half their life?

    "Billy" wrote:
    It must be a serious issue for some retirees for them to speak up to the point where Upshaw makes such threats as eliminating alumni chapters, and also for such credible players such as Birk (and Ditka) to support them.
    Yeah, I think Birk is smart enough to realize how to take care of his money and doesn't need his entire salary to support his lifestyle.
    Given that, he feels helping the old guys is the right thing to do.
    Ditka probably feels the same way, but he's not coming from the same place as Birk because his salary wouldn't be affected, and it's his job to comment on the issues and draw attention to himself.

    "Billy" wrote:
    I understand that you think teams should supply necessary pension (makes sense to me)
    but as the system is right now it is a NFLPA matter and in Upshaw's hands but according to the retirees he isn't doing enough.
    That's certainly true!
    But think of their bias - I also feel that the NFL isn't doing enough to support me.
    Of course, I'm just some random guy, but it'd be nice to get a piece of that pie.
    Hey, I'd even take a break on ticket prices!

    "Billy" wrote:
    No matter how I look at it this guy seems like a prick worried about his incumbency.
    I can see why, but I personally have a hard time blaming the guy for doing his job the best way he knows how.
    When the age of the Vikings came to a close, they must have sensed it. Probably, they gathered together one evening, slapped each other on the back and said, "Hey, good job." - Jack Handey [Deep Thoughts]

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