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  1. #21
    Traveling_Vike is offline Coordinator
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    I'll take brains over brawn any day, as long as I have the time to develop it. I don't think anyone has ever said that Joe Montana was particularly gifted physically. and Dan Marino was a statue for the most part, but with the quickest release ever. (Although in all honesty he's not the brightest bulb in the chandelier either, but he had football smarts.) On the other hand, Elway was the physically gifted one, and he did pretty well too. Not a genius, but smart enough.

    No, I am not trying to compare Ponder to any of these guys, so don't even go there. I'm just throwing out some examples.

    Smart QBs also last longer. The runners almost always have shortened careers. If I'm looking for a franchise guy, I want one who will be with me for a good long while.

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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    If he doesn't have the speed, size and arm strength to play in the NFL I would sure as hell like to see him play pronto and find out than to wait a year or two and then be 2 more years behind the curve finding our next QB of the future.

    Sitting on the bench might benefit a player who cannot comprehend a playbook but holding a clipboard is not going to make his arm stronger, it isn't going to make him run faster and he probably isn't going to go through a growth spurt standing on the sidelines.

    If he is smart enough to play then it is time right now to see if his body can do what his mind tells it to and that is only going to happen in a live game situation.
    Sorry, perhaps I should have worded it differently.

    Newton has the size, speed and arm to succeed instantly in the NFL, Ponder does not.

    Newton can get away with with using his physical skills to make up for lack of experience and smarts, Ponder can not.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_bleed_purple View Post
    Only decade?

    I'd take a rookie Newton right now over every single QB we've drafted since Tark, and over every vet we've had period.

    Again, there's a reason Newton was drafted #1 overall, he has a load of talent and potential. The question was is he able to use that potential to play QB?

    Seems he is.

    Comparing Newton to Ponder is like comparing Peterson to Ciatrick Fason.
    Ciatrick Fason is a BEAST!

    I read it here on PP.O

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_bleed_purple View Post
    Sorry, perhaps I should have worded it differently.

    Newton has the size, speed and arm to succeed instantly in the NFL, Ponder does not.

    Newton can get away with with using his physical skills to make up for lack of experience and smarts, Ponder can not.
    I am not sure that your restatement really changed anything.

    Can you do a better job of explaining how sitting on the bench is going to do anything for his size, speed or his arm?

    I take it you are not questioning whether he is ready mentally? Because I can buy the idea that a QB who has the physical tool but hasn't grasped the concepts mentally would certainly benefit from sitting on the bench while they learn the playbook.

    But if a QB already has the mental part down from a classroom standpoint then really their only limitations would be whether they are physically gifted enough to play the position and holding the clip board isn't going to help that.

    For instance- Lets use Webb as an example- I do believe he is better suited to holding the clipboard in terms of developing as a QB because his learning curve on the textbook part of the position is more than likely still developing and will more than likely take a few years for him to comprehend and catch up to his physical skills. I think we are on the same page there. But if Ponder has the smarts they say he does and if he knows the offense the way it has been stated he does then IMHO he is as ready to go as any of the QB's playing in the league right now that started their first year.

    Now, if it comes to light that he doesn't have the physical skills to play in the league then by all means we need to figure that out and move on rather than leaving him hanging around like the last project.

  5. #25
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    It doesn't matter if you throw for 1000 yards a game and have 5 TD passes, if you are still losing.

    AP passed 6k yards and broke chuck foremans vikings record for most TD's. When he was interviewed, he said it doesn't equal to a hill of beans, if we don't win.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by STCLOUDSAYSGOVIKES View Post
    It doesn't matter if you throw for 1000 yards a game and have 5 TD passes, if you are still losing.

    AP passed 6k yards and broke chuck foremans vikings record for most TD's. When he was interviewed, he said it doesn't equal to a hill of beans, if we don't win.
    Losses are not always the worst if it is leading towards building for the future as is the case in Carolina. They are not winning but they lost 2 games to teams that have more talent than they do and they were at least competitive. If the Vikings went that route and played that far above expectations I would be fine with it.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    Losses are not always the worst if it is leading towards building for the future as is the case in Carolina. They are not winning but they lost 2 games to teams that have more talent than they do and they were at least competitive. If the Vikings went that route and played that far above expectations I would be fine with it.
    Were the vikings competitive in both games, yes.

    Are they building towards the future, yes. Regardless what you define as the future, if you base it purely on definition then they are. That could mean next week, or next year.

    They played 2 teams with high expectations.
    Tampa Bay- Made a 6 win improvement last year over '09.
    San diego- some expect them to represent the AFC in the super bowl this season, and those same people and many more expect Philip Rivers to compete for MVP of the league.

    Expectations here are wins, not competitive losses.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    If he doesn't have the speed, size and arm strength to play in the NFL I would sure as hell like to see him play pronto and find out than to wait a year or two and then be 2 more years behind the curve finding our next QB of the future.

    Sitting on the bench might benefit a player who cannot comprehend a playbook but holding a clipboard is not going to make his arm stronger, it isn't going to make him run faster and he probably isn't going to go through a growth spurt standing on the sidelines.

    If he is smart enough to play then it is time right now to see if his body can do what his mind tells it to and that is only going to happen in a live game situation.
    What an excellent post.

    They were talking about Newtons mistakes on NFLN last night. To a man they said that the mistakes he is making this year will only accelerate his growth so that he doesn't make as many next year.

    For the life of me I can't figure out why sitting a kid on the bench helps you figure out if he is going to make those mistakes or not.

    At somepoint you are going to have to run him out there and let him try it at game speed. Why wait 3 or 4 years to see if he can overcome that stuff?

    Cause you might mess with his head? Said it before and I'll say it again, if it messes with his head as a rookie, it will mess with his head as a 4 year vet.

    The only reason to sit a rookie QB is if you have a guy who is better in front of him. Nothing more, nothing less. If you don't have that cat, you'd better run your rookie out there and find out what his makeup is so you can either continue to develop him or go get someone else.

    For some strange reason I think Ponder is one of those cats who won't let rookie mistakes (or veteran mistakes later on in his career) mess with his head.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by STCLOUDSAYSGOVIKES View Post
    Were the vikings competitive in both games, yes.

    Are they building towards the future, yes. Regardless what you define as the future, if you base it purely on definition then they are. That could mean next week, or next year.

    They played 2 teams with high expectations.
    Tampa Bay- Made a 6 win improvement last year over '09.
    San diego- some expect them to represent the AFC in the super bowl this season, and those same people and many more expect Philip Rivers to compete for MVP of the league.

    Expectations here are wins, not competitive losses.
    Thats what I like to hear.

    All is not lost. We saw progress last week over the first week.

    The play calling got better. They were a bit more creative with the use of S's instead of just LB'rs to get pressure. K-dubb is coming back so that will help in that regard, if his foot is better.

    Heck, even Leslie might have learned how to manage the clock after last weeks gaff.

    Things are looking up.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traveling_Vike View Post
    I'll take brains over brawn any day, as long as I have the time to develop it. I don't think anyone has ever said that Joe Montana was particularly gifted physically. and Dan Marino was a statue for the most part, but with the quickest release ever. (Although in all honesty he's not the brightest bulb in the chandelier either, but he had football smarts.) On the other hand, Elway was the physically gifted one, and he did pretty well too. Not a genius, but smart enough.

    No, I am not trying to compare Ponder to any of these guys, so don't even go there. I'm just throwing out some examples.

    Smart QBs also last longer. The runners almost always have shortened careers. If I'm looking for a franchise guy, I want one who will be with me for a good long while.
    YUP, your still on the "Those that have a clue" spreadsheet.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

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